Just so I am clear, he want’s friends but does nothing to make new ones or hold his current ones. And he complains about not knowing his dad but his dad makes the effort to know him.
I guess I have a few questions too, does he attend school, does he hold a job, and does his dad ever offer to hang out with him (Rather than just talking)?
Dr. Jackson wrote:
Just so I am clear, he want’s friends but does nothing to make new ones or hold his current ones. And he complains about not knowing his dad but his dad makes the effort to know him.
I guess I have a few questions too, does he attend school, does he hold a job, and does his dad ever offer to hang out with him (Rather than just talking)?
He does attend school and keeps very high grades, he works summers, and I don’t know too much about him and his dad (I have never met him personally)
It seems very weird to me, his way of seeing things, which is I guess why I’m having a hard time giving fair advice to Jane. :/ Totally at a loss…
I think if she does love, and doesn’t want to ruin her relationship, she should listen to his problems. Maybe they can go out together and meet new people (friends) together. If she doesn’t want to do that, maybe its not that good a relationship.
soccer_chick101 wrote:
I think if she does love, and doesn’t want to ruin her relationship, she should listen to his problems. Maybe they can go out together and meet new people (friends) together. If she doesn’t want to do that, maybe its not that good a relationship.
She does, and often brings him out with her friends (both male and female, 18-30 years old, musical or non musical, so he has his pick of friends if he only made the effort) It’s the summers apart where most of his lonely woes come up because Jane isn’t there to take John Smith out with her friends. :/
Lawliet wrote:
soccer_chick101 wrote:
I think if she does love, and doesn’t want to ruin her relationship, she should listen to his problems. Maybe they can go out together and meet new people (friends) together. If she doesn’t want to do that, maybe its not that good a relationship.
She does, and often brings him out with her friends (both male and female, 18-30 years old, musical or non musical, so he has his pick of friends if he only made the effort) It’s the summers apart where most of his lonely woes come up because Jane isn’t there to take John Smith out with her friends. :/
okay so are you sure they’re meant to be together?
soccer_chick101 wrote:
Lawliet wrote:
soccer_chick101 wrote:
I think if she does love, and doesn’t want to ruin her relationship, she should listen to his problems. Maybe they can go out together and meet new people (friends) together. If she doesn’t want to do that, maybe its not that good a relationship.
She does, and often brings him out with her friends (both male and female, 18-30 years old, musical or non musical, so he has his pick of friends if he only made the effort) It’s the summers apart where most of his lonely woes come up because Jane isn’t there to take John Smith out with her friends. :/
okay so are you sure they’re meant to be together?
Me? No idea, not my relationship. I’m just the Dear Abby she turns to so I’m trying to learn how to help her.
But that might be the question to ask her… I have asked similar things “are you happy being with him?” “do you feel right about being in this relationship” and she always says either yes, or that she’s not sure but want’s it to be because when they are together they are so happy. Long distance, even for one summer, is tough. Her being annoyed at her bf makes it harder, and listening to the same problems every other week when he never takes her advice is wearing down on her.
come to think of it, I think he’s dependent on her… That’s a good revelation to talk to her about actually.
During this past summer I took an anthropology class and I came across the deep realization of exactly why it is people act the way they do (like many on this site actually). Such as why so many people are su1c1dal and depressed constantly. It basically comes down to the fact that when they grew up they were never exposed to failures and hardships like most normal people in the past should have been. So like when you and I grew up we likely had to grow up with some hardship (Like being punished for doing something wrong or facing severe heartbreak early on). Where as several people (possibly including john smith) never had to face such things and as such is unable(incapable) of dealing with the situation because they have absolutly no idea how to. And then taking advice from someone too is the same thing, they never learned to actually listen to advice when they were younger so as an adult it’s completely oblivious to them. It’s actually a quite complex thought and understanding but once you realize it, well situations like this really begin to make sense. I am sure you understand it too to some if not all degrees. (lol, wall of text paragraph).
Anywho, the reason I asked those questions is because it sounds like he was slightly sheltered as a child where it caused him to not want to either change or be put in a situation with new friends that aren’t already his friends. If he only does summer jobs I am going to take a guess that he likely works with people he’s known a long time. Something that could help break this is for him to get a job in customer service (or a job with lots of people) so that he can force break the habit.
Because the only issue seems to be that your friend is bothered by her boyfriend’s complaints about his problems, he either needs to stop complaining so much or she needs to stop getting so bothered. I think if your friend explained carefully to her boyfriend about how irritated his complaints make her considering she has had a rougher time, that would be a way to address the issue, but usually people get offended by that. My guess is she has explained this to him already, but gently, in a way to spare his feelings. Maybe the only way to really put this issue to rest is to get in there and make it CLEAR to him how she feels about his whining. This might jeopardize the relationship though. I think if she can handle it, the best way to make this issue go away, would be for her to stop judging her boyfriend and try to be supportive despite her incomprehension and resentment. Sorry, those are the only two ways I can think of, and they honestly don’t seem foolproof to me. Maybe lots of other people will come and give great advice like couples counseling or something.
Dr. Jackson wrote:
During this past summer I took an anthropology class and I came across the deep realization of exactly why it is people act the way they do (like many on this site actually). Such as why so many people are su1c1dal and depressed constantly. It basically comes down to the fact that when they grew up they were never exposed to failures and hardships like most normal people in the past should have been. So like when you and I grew up we likely had to grow up with some hardship (Like being punished for doing something wrong or facing severe heartbreak early on). Where as several people (possibly including john smith) never had to face such things and as such is unable(incapable) of dealing with the situation because they have absolutly no idea how to. And then taking advice from someone too is the same thing, they never learned to actually listen to advice when they were younger so as an adult it’s completely oblivious to them. It’s actually a quite complex thought and understanding but once you realize it, well situations like this really begin to make sense. I am sure you understand it too to some if not all degrees. (lol, wall of text paragraph).
Anywho, the reason I asked those questions is because it sounds like he was slightly sheltered as a child where it caused him to not want to either change or be put in a situation with new friends that aren’t already his friends. If he only does summer jobs I am going to take a guess that he likely works with people he’s known a long time. Something that could help break this is for him to get a job in customer service (or a job with lots of people) so that he can force break the habit.
This makes a lot of sense, and I too have realized that a persons experiences really change their character. I find it nearly impossible to have a good friendship with someone who hasn’t had something difficult in their lives, because we’re on such different levels.
I know that is what is happening here. He has had, in comparison to Jane, a very easy life. So little things that would never bother Jane bother him, which frustrates her.
I might repeat this nearly word for word to her. I’m sure she’s realized it herself but you never know.
All that’s left is, how do they communicate about it? How can she explain this to him without making him feel less important or making him feel petty? It turns into a delicate issue… if he has never had to deal with something very tough, how would he deal with his girlfriend telling him he is essentially being a wuss?
How does one kindly tell someone they are being a wuss? I know she doesn’t mean to see him int hat light, but considering all factors…
verge wrote:
Because the only issue seems to be that your friend is bothered by her boyfriend’s complaints about his problems, he either needs to stop complaining so much or she needs to stop getting so bothered. I think if your friend explained carefully to her boyfriend about how irritated his complaints make her considering she has had a rougher time, that would be a way to address the issue, but usually people get offended by that. My guess is she has explained this to him already, but gently, in a way to spare his feelings. Maybe the only way to really put this issue to rest is to get in there and make it CLEAR to him how she feels about his whining. This might jeopardize the relationship though. I think if she can handle it, the best way to make this issue go away, would be for her to stop judging her boyfriend and try to be supportive despite her incomprehension and resentment. Sorry, those are the only two ways I can think of, and they honestly don’t seem foolproof to me. Maybe lots of other people will come and give great advice like couples counseling or something.
I think you’re right. But how does one say these things? She doesn’t want to hurt his feelings, that’s why she’s so confused about how to fix this, but neither of us can figure out how to let him know, gently but clearly, how she feels?
Lawliet wrote:
All that’s left is, how do they communicate about it? How can she explain this to him without making him feel less important or making him feel petty? It turns into a delicate issue… if he has never had to deal with something very tough, how would he deal with his girlfriend telling him he is essentially being a wuss?
How does one kindly tell someone they are being a wuss? I know she doesn’t mean to see him int hat light, but considering all factors…
Honestly I can’t see any circumstance where it’s accepted that easily in a straight forward conversation (Short of a video game or movie lol). Though if he was to learn this and have a revelation on his own it could have propounding effects. The greatest affect for change is a strong will and reason. If he can figure it out on his own he will untimely want to change on his own for the better.
But… How to do that, well one of the ways that worked for me was working with older men at a hardware store. They gave sage-like advice that after a while really sunk in and stuck at the molecular level. Another way for me was complete and utter failure and hitting the bottom (Figuratively), and it really showed me the errors of my ways.
So thats why I was recommending a job. Or, maybe an intervention with all of his friends in the same room and kinda one siding it to where they all want to help him see that he’s got a problem. Of course it all depends on his personality on how he reacts. It could be good or bad.
Maybe, one day, after he’s finished talking about how disappointed he is in his dad, she could say, “You know honey, the way you talk about your dad actually makes me feel really badly because it is so much better than the relationship I have with my own. Mine does blah blah bad things while yours does blah blah nice things, and it really frustrates me/makes me sad to hear you complain (I’d find a more sensitive word for complain though) about him and throw away a relationship with him.”
lol, not untimely, it’s suppose to be ultimately…
Dr. Jackson wrote:
Lawliet wrote:
All that’s left is, how do they communicate about it? How can she explain this to him without making him feel less important or making him feel petty? It turns into a delicate issue… if he has never had to deal with something very tough, how would he deal with his girlfriend telling him he is essentially being a wuss?
How does one kindly tell someone they are being a wuss? I know she doesn’t mean to see him int hat light, but considering all factors…
Honestly I can’t see any circumstance where it’s accepted that easily in a straight forward conversation (Short of a video game or movie lol). Though if he was to learn this and have a revelation on his own it could have propounding effects. The greatest affect for change is a strong will and reason. If he can figure it out on his own he will untimely want to change on his own for the better.
But… How to do that, well one of the ways that worked for me was working with older men at a hardware store. They gave sage-like advice that after a while really sunk in and stuck at the molecular level. Another way for me was complete and utter failure and hitting the bottom (Figuratively), and it really showed me the errors of my ways.
So thats why I was recommending a job. Or, maybe an intervention with all of his friends in the same room and kinda one siding it to where they all want to help him see that he’s got a problem. Of course it all depends on his personality on how he reacts. It could be good or bad.
hmm… sounds mildly complicated for that sort of person… I think older company such as those in a work environment could be beneficial though. He’s in music now and very talented, and so it used to being praised for his accomplishments. This might make him feel that there isn’t anything to change, or that he shouldn’t have to change… Of course this is an assumption, like I said I haven’t had the chance to meet the fellow. Not easy to profile such a person…
verge wrote:
Maybe, one day, after he’s finished talking about how disappointed he is in his dad, she could say, “You know honey, the way you talk about your dad actually makes me feel really badly because it is so much better than the relationship I have with my own. Mine does blah blah bad things while yours does blah blah nice things, and it really frustrates me/makes me sad to hear you complain (I’d find a more sensitive word for complain though) about him and throw away a relationship with him.”
This sounds near perfect actually! maybe if he realized how things could be much worse, and are fr some people, he would feel better about his situation… assuming that he isn’t the sort to get defensive and think she’s not taking him seriously. hmm
Dr. Jackson wrote:
lol, not untimely, it’s suppose to be ultimately…
I figured :P
Lawliet wrote:
Of course this is an assumption, like I said I haven’t had the chance to meet the fellow. Not easy to profile such a person…
———–
assuming that he isn’t the sort to get defensive and think she’s not taking him seriously. hmm
Yeah, a problem that is repeatedly presented on help.com, not knowing the person.
And yeah, when I was reading it I was thinking the same thing, it’s all in the toss of a coin really. He could take it very defensively.
verge wrote:
Maybe, one day, after he’s finished talking about how disappointed he is in his dad, she could say, “You know honey, the way you talk about your dad actually makes me feel really badly because it is so much better than the relationship I have with my own. Mine does blah blah bad things while yours does blah blah nice things, and it really frustrates me/makes me sad to hear you complain (I’d find a more sensitive word for complain though) about him and throw away a relationship with him.”
Lawliet wrote:
This sounds near perfect actually! maybe if he realized how things could be much worse, and are fr some people, he would feel better about his situation… assuming that he isn’t the sort to get defensive and think she’s not taking him seriously. hmm
I think if he gets defensive, and she can’t learn to live with his whining, there’s probably no hope. But maybe if she just sort of drives home how he doesn’t have much right to be constantly complaining about it by just telling him how sad it makes her feel without attaching any judgements at all to his behavior with words like complain, things might be solvable.
Dr. Jackson wrote:
Lawliet wrote:
Of course this is an assumption, like I said I haven’t had the chance to meet the fellow. Not easy to profile such a person…
———–
assuming that he isn’t the sort to get defensive and think she’s not taking him seriously. hmm
Yeah, a problem that is repeatedly presented on help.com, not knowing the person.
And yeah, when I was reading it I was thinking the same thing, it’s all in the toss of a coin really. He could take it very defensively.
I suppose I’ll just have to tell Jane everything that came about here and wish her luck. Thank goodness I’m little more than a timid voice of reason and not the one determining any factor in this relationship!! Yes… I’ll tell her some of these new thoughts and leave the rest to her.
Thank you both for helping out so much. I want nothing more than to be a good friend, so thank you for helping me achieve that :)
verge wrote:
I think if he gets defensive, and she can’t learn to live with his whining, there’s probably no hope.
Honestly I myself didn’t do a 180 life change until my first real love dumped me and told me she hated me. It really threw a gear in my train of thought. While I know that doesn’t work for everyone, it… well it may come to it.
Dr. Jackson wrote:
verge wrote:
I think if he gets defensive, and she can’t learn to live with his whining, there’s probably no hope.
Honestly I myself didn’t do a 180 life change until my first real love dumped me and told me she hated me. It really threw a gear in my train of thought. While I know that doesn’t work for everyone, it… well it may come to it.
I hope it doesnt…. but you never know.
Dr. Jackson wrote:
Honestly I myself didn’t do a 180 life change until my first real love dumped me and told me she hated me. It really threw a gear in my train of thought. While I know that doesn’t work for everyone, it… well it may come to it.
I’m glad you changed your life for the better.
Lawliet wrote:
Thank you both for helping out so much. I want nothing more than to be a good friend, so thank you for helping me achieve that :)
You’re welcome, you sound like a good friend :)
verge wrote:
I’m glad you changed your life for the better.
Ahh well this happened 8-9 years ago, so not really news lol.
verge wrote:
Dr. Jackson wrote:
Honestly I myself didn’t do a 180 life change until my first real love dumped me and told me she hated me. It really threw a gear in my train of thought. While I know that doesn’t work for everyone, it… well it may come to it.
I’m glad you changed your life for the better.
Lawliet wrote:
Thank you both for helping out so much. I want nothing more than to be a good friend, so thank you for helping me achieve that :)
You’re welcome, you sound like a good friend :)
I try!
Everyone should just be honest and say everything that they want to say, If its too hard in person write a letter. If its meant to be it will be.
New development; Apparently, his family went on a vacation without him. Didn’t even ask him to go. Just up and left. His brother was so mad they left John Smith behind he didn’t go.
No explanation.
So…. wow. Jane is understanding a hell of a lot more now…
Heh, been there… That’s a truly unique feeling too.
Maybe this’ll make them closer :)
Ya know, I was just thinking, maybe your friends dad could spend time with her boyfriend so maybe he can feel like her dad would be a good dad for him too. If her parents are that awesome I’m sure he would consider it.
her dad is, quite frankly, a sexist, abusive dirtbag. In her own words. I can’t imagien her wanting him to be her boyfriend’s role model.
He’s horrid to her and verbally abuses her all the time. Her mother is an amazing, wonderful woman and she can’t understand why she doesn’t leave that man. she is an incredibly strong girl to have become the person she is today, and the person she plans to become.
ⓘⓝⓚ edited this post 5 months, 3 weeks ago. Read the previous text »
Boyfriend help!
Well, not for me… a friend of mine has been going out with this very nice guy from her college, but there have been snags that I can’t seem to think around. (She often asks me for advice since I have been in what she calls the “perfect relationship” for three and a half years. Apparently I am a wealth of knowledge, but really, my boyfriend and I are just two insane people who get along swimmingly. Back to the story;)
First of all, she want’s to fix these problems, no abort the relationship. They aren’t that severe, so if your solution is to end things, kindly step away knowing we are aware of that possibility and she would rather improve things and end things if it actually does end up sucking.
Ok, onward! So my friend has had it rough. Her dad is sexist and believes she is useless, and has told her so on many occasions. Her boyfriend, let’s call him…. John Smith. So John Smith is a middle child and feels like he has no relationship with his father, but his dad is always making an effort. Asking him how he is, what’s going on, you seem down, do you want to talk? You know, a good dad who wants a relationship with his son. But John Smith will lash out and say nothing is wrong then complain to my friend, let’s call her Jane, that he has no relationship with his dad.
So she get’s annoyed, because in her mind, he is being irrational and is lucky to have such a caring father.
Next bit: He complains about being lonely and having no friends, but he makes zero effort to get any. He doesn’t like to hang out with people unless they are friends of someone he already knows, and even then, he only hangs out when that one friend is around. Jane has loads of friends, loves meeting new people, thrives on a great and diverse social life and can’t understand why John Smith would complain about being lonely when he doesn’t try to make friends.
What it boils down to is, they love each other every much, but she has a hard time talking to him about his problems when they seem so petty. She understands that since he has had an easier life, relatively, problems that are small to her are big to him, but it’s still hard for her to deal with it.
I have tried every approach I can think of, but I’ve run out of advice and she has tried everything we can think of to talk to him about it. Usually it sorts itself out and for a week or two it’s like it never happened, but it’s a resurfacing problem that she wants to sort out so they can be happy together.
So… what do you think? What advice can I give her when we talk about this? Your time is much appreciated :)
ⓘⓝⓚ closed this post.
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Dr. Jackson
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